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+---- Thread: So it begins...... Battery spot welder (/thread-4548.html)
So it begins...... Battery spot welder - sternwake - 10-17-2023
Or 18650's
I'm nearly there.
Anyone else?
I've got an E skateboard ordered.
Cheapo starter unit.
106$ delivered.
'en route'
. 350 watt motor.
24v,2200mah battery
10mph/16kph claimed max speed.
8 mile claimed range
*For 1, 170Lb/77 KG rider.
quote unquote har har.....
It will however fit in the interior Dry hatch of my used, but newly acquired, Sit on top Kayak.
There is a private,
riff raff free,
well,
before me,
Kayak launch
A mile away, paved roads.
Inter coastal waterway.
design and build kayak trolley, pull with E Skate, bobs your uncle.
I expect theEskate Eprovided battery pack to use marginal quality low capacity Medium CDR
, poorly matched 18650 Cells.
I expect little care was used to assemble them.
I expect the power supply/'charger' to deliver a questionable max charge voltage .
I suspect the BMS is inaccurate and easily fooled, and not really safe.
I suspect I can greatly improve the battery, and increase range via higher capacity high quality cells , High CDR cells which can deliver higher voltage, for longer.
I expect Electronic speed control and electric motor Heatsinking, and wiring resistance from and to, can be vastly improved
I could very well be wrong.
I have not been researching trolling motors, or 'thrusters' and have no intentions of forcing a displacement hull, to plane.
LIAR!
But maximum displacement speed might be around 12mph, with 8mph achieved, using 1/4 the power. I think I can hold 2.5 to 3.5mph on paddle power alone.
Up until 4 weeks ago ive never even paddled a kayak, but it felt so natural and easy, and fast, i Bought it from my cousin.
But thrusters no importa pronto.
I just want a longer, larger paddle for now, as The one which came with my kayak, never expected a Neanderthal and his Nutjob sheepdog to become the region's most avid Cormorant hunters.
The Paddle is too short, and too small.
Too much motor, too little prop.
That's what she said!
Well, Cormorants, gulls, pelicans, get vigorously barked at, not really hunted..
Ospreys, she is mute.
It is extremely therapeutic. Till it is not.
Fine Line.
After I become hoarse from barking,
Fiona carries on, and on, and on.
please shut up!!!!!
Grrrrrrrrr!
Bonding traction pads to polypropylene is the first obstacle.
woof woof!
SPLASH!
No bull sharks here.
Thin Sapele platform perch grid, fore and aft, me thinks.
all hail pad eyes and attachment points
The kayak has so much wasted space inside.....
So much that js currently inaccessable, till the waTerproof hatches and fishing pole holders
arrive.
Im as keen to buildout the KaYak, as I waS for my van.
I can fit several Surfboads in the ceiling of my van unobtrusively, but the single Kayak just refuses to comfortably comply , so far.
On top will destroy solar Harvest.
Oh well, Van ain't registered, nor insured yet, anyway.
72 miles since JaNuary, Zero miles since May.
But the paperwork to do so is in hand.
But My DMV gumption, is lacking.
Anyway, this project joins many others, but this project's completion has mental and physical health ramifications unlike the others, and I made Fiona a promise when I Adopted her that I intend to keep.
she loves it.
once a week is Six times too few.
Just beginning to shop battery spot welders.
I'm a ways away from actually ordering anything else.
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - rvpopeye - 10-18-2023
Two sailors back on the sea tis the important part.
Everything else is an accessory.
(or an experiment in fine tuning the accessories)
I'd love to see a video of you and yer 1st mate "seadog" patrolling the local waterways , and backwaterways.
And an electric surfboard of the pavement kind ,,, walking a plank @ 10mph .
Stowing the kayak on/in the van? Hmmmm
How about out on the passenger side ?
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - sternwake - 10-18-2023
The Yak is 11' long, 31 inches wide, about a foot thick, and about 50 lbs.
Putting my roof racks back on partially shades the unisolar pvl-68, though i never bothered to see how much output was lost, before I removed them.
Getting the Yak up there might prove challenging too.
Am not living from the van now anyway, but always consider the possibilities.
Been reading some E skateboard forums. There sure is enthusiastic talent there and so much I do not know. These guys never had to worry about lead acid.
Looks like another rabbit hole. Glad I dont need to do 42mph on a skateboard.
I've yet to take my phone out on the yak with us, but will soon have a nice easily accessible waterproof hatch.
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - sternwake - 10-20-2023
The Yak has pushed all other optional projects to the side.
The fore Fiona perch is coming along.
Sapele wood, far too beautiful to adhere a traction pad to, but at least the bottom will be purdy.
Laminating Epoxy, instead of wood glue.
The 8"' locking hatch arrived and is installed witbout sealant, so far.
I bought some original shoe goo, am testing adhesion to the cutout, using vaRious methods, and E6000 and amazing goop. All similar products, butdedicated polypropylene adhesives are special order and expensive, and a few Kayak internet nerds swear shoe goo, the original, will bond OK to polypropylene.
I got 2 fishing pole holders, and there are dual recesses on the sides behind the seat to install them.
However, unless i were to cut my paddle stroke in half, i would slam the back of my arm into the fishing pole.
So I drilled the cutout for just one pole holder, directly behind the seat where it is out of the way and i can use the full potential stroke range.
Also, it holds an umbrella nicely.
The hatch came with no fasteners, the pole holders did, but pan head screws into countersunk receptacles means i got all new stainless hardware at ACE.
A 12-24v 75mm diameter 300 watt thruster, for RC boats, is surprisingly affordable. 5.5 lbs of thrust when fed 24v. No idea how much assist this would provide. Dual ciunterrotating motors for potential 11lbs of thrust is what I would employ.
Stealth like.
I dont want the obvious trolling motor setup.
Not sure if E boats still fly under the radar like E bikes do, in most areas
But it might never happen. Will see how a longer lighter paddle works, as the one i got seems way too small to tire me properly.
No need to reinvent the wheel regarding Kayak trolley. Found a product for 40$ with 8 inch wheels, and breaks down, and might fit inside for Hatch with E skateboard.
The cheapo 350watt E Skate is supposed to arrive tomorrow.
The E skate forums are a wealth of knowledge. Some of those guys are really stuffing ridiculous amounts of 2!700s into their mountain boards and claiming 60miles/100km of range, and scary amounts of torque and top speeds.
Some really professional looking custom battery builds, designed to flex with the skate deck.
A far cry from getting a waLky world marine Battery and slapping some ring terminals on it.
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - sternwake - 10-21-2023
E skate arrived after dark, when I was already several beers deep.
Radar sign said I was going 10mph.
It struggles a bit going uphill slightly, and downhill slightly, makes it happy.
I am about 25 lbs under its max rated weight.
So weird to have a brake on a skateboard, almost as weird as not needing to push.
Being used to a long skate deck
the short skate with long kicktail, put me on my butt.
Sore shoulder, butt is fine.
The battery/BMS enclosure has no obvious fasteners, or it would likely already be apart for inspection.
The 7, 2200 mah 'claimed' batteries in series within, are of dubious age, and quality, but for 106$ taxed and delivered, i am impressed.
Some high end 18650s, or 21700s, should help greatly, and cost perhaos half again as much as the board.
Charger/power supply says 29.4v, 1.5 amps.
4.2x7=29.4.
red light on supply, turns green, when supposedly fully charged.
Push button on skate battery ennlosure has 4 lights, like makita 18v battery indicating state of chaRge, but when turned off and charging, no lights.
Have not yet confirmed. voltage or amperage, but my dc to dc booster can be dialed into 29.40v, meaning can charge From van, inverter free.
The 300/350 watt hub motor gets quite warm, as I'm almost always at full throttle. some specs say 350, some say 300.
1 wheel drive.
I dont see any finned heatsinking to help dissilpaTe that heat.
The 3 wires within the sheath from ESC/battery enclosure to hub motor.... well, 1 8awg insulated cable would be thicker.
300 watts, 24 nominal v, 12.5 amps.
So maybe 3 16awg wires in that sheath, feeding the motor, at best?
No way 3 14 awg wires fit.
Its very weird trying to foot push and use electric motor, said my shoulder.
dooh!
So awesome to not have to push.
I'd like 12 to 14mph. 10 is ok, for now, but towing a Fiona laden kayak trolley....... mopowahmobettah
Got a beep from the throttle remote flashing 1 light as to state of charge, goin slightly uphill, after about 3.5 miles of cruising fulk throttle, but turned around slightly downhill and 2 lights.
took less than an hour to 'fully charge' from that point.
The kayak launch is 1 mile there and 1 back, and perhaps 2' of elevation change, so it should have enough juice to get us there and back. depends on how well the trolley's 8" wheels roll..
......
Saw a Saffa on youtube rigged up a pair of 5.5 lb 'thrusters' to a kayak.
Said he used 3 batteries in parallel.
I'll assume 6 or 8 amp hour 12v agms at best
Could not see them deep inside the group 31 battery box. so they coukd have been smaller.
I think he said got 4 to 5km/h from them, but were they 24v thrusters being fed 12v from tiny 12v agms in parallel with dubious interconnects?
If so, they were only ~ 5lbs of thrust, or less, not the rated 11.
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - rvpopeye - 10-22-2023
I imagine you towing the afore mentioned load was a grand sight !
Think we'd all like ta see a pic ov dat !
(or at least Fi and da travel rigged yak)
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - sternwake - 10-22-2023
No kayak trolley yet, but Fiona is very interested in the skate board.
years ago, i did the carrot and stick thing, with a tennisball. probably hit 10mph.
I am currently away from workshoo and my tools.
I found the battery enclosure fasteners under the grip tape,by using a magnet.
Allen key required. not one available, but this torx bit fits.
5 screws unscrew without issue.
the 6th, strips.
Cursefest.
Dammitt all to fornicating Hell!
i wanna see the insides!
which cells does it use? what CDR.. continuous discharge rate?
I wanna know, now, dammit!
A 300 watt motor divided by 29.4 volts says the 2200mah baTteries should have at least a 10.2 amp CDR.
Say they are 20amp CDR 2200 mah ells.
Fullly charged and fully loaded, their voltage falls to what?
A 25 amp CDR cell should be able to maintain higher voltage under same load.
what if they are only 11amp CDR cells?
Higher voltage should mean more power to motor, means better acceleration, and top speed.
There is 2800 mah cells with a 40 amp CDR available
Will 21700s fit?
The Samung 50s has 5000mah and a 25 amp CDR..
The Epoch P45b has 4500mah and a 45amp CDR.
I aimed at same radar sign today, and it said 11mph. warmer wheels, baTtery, tailwind?
I wanna move the bac tru k further back, i dont need the kicktail leverage,
I would not have bruised my shoukder if the damn kicktail was shorter
kicktail induced tricks are for kids, not grey hairs.
I want a wider wheelbase.
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - sternwake - 10-23-2023
The Battery/ESC enclosure has been opened.
Funny, the T Handle skate tool lroclvided with board, has an allen key.
This alleen key does not fit enclosure mounting screws, nor the screws at motor.. But I had one which did, and dremmeled a slot in the stripped SOB screw for a flat head screwdriver.
The 7S1P battery, is shrink wrapped, and adhered to the enclosure.
I didn'thave enough desire to cut it open.
No way 7 21700s fit inside the enclosure. without some pretty hefty modification, and perhaos not even then.
Balls.
After reassembly, and a quick test, it was way down on power.
cursefest.
Later realized the remote controller has the ability to limit max power. I somehow set it to 50%.
Nothing about this feafure, in the instruction manual.
Got thirsty.
Empty backpack?
check.
Wallett,
check.
Be right back. Sweetie.
Hit than new ultra smooth Pavement behind liquor store strip mall.
So quiet, so smooth. Hit perhaps 12mph.
I can push my other regular skate faster, but cant keep that up for long., and 50+ year old abused joints protest.
So took the long way around to get the green Fosters oilcans
sboulda got 4.
disassembled enclosure further.
XT60 connector in between battery and BMS.
never fondled one before.
Tight firm fit. Chose anderSon powerpoles long ago. No regrets, but this connector is pretty solid too me thinks.
Fround barrel connector charge port always live, reading battery voltage.
Placed Anderson powerpoles on power supply /charger supply output
placed wattmeter inline.
1.5 amp charger delivers 1.53 amps.
open circuiit no load voltage over 30v.!!!!!?!! WTF!
supposed to be 29.4:.
plug into charge.
a whike later, I notice voltage at 29.8v! still accepting 0.5 amps.
unplug charger, takes battery about a minute before Voltage falls below 29.5.
The power supply will over charge the cells! and i have no faith there is ay cell balancing occurring via the bms inside heatshrink wrapped 7S1P battery
If aiming for 100% chargex, it shoukld terminate charging when amps taPer to 0.1, at 29.4000 volts.
Still delivering 0.5 amps at 29.8v is totally unacceptable.
dangerous.
Looks like my custom multi voltage current limiiting dc to dc power supply, needs to haplen sooner than later.
The skate fits inside Kayak hatch.
Nose of upside xown Yak, can sits on shelf over drivers seT in vN, and i can fit the Yak inside, and pulledr high to rear shelf, can move around underneath it. Can still cit a finned longboard and finlezss short surfboard on ceiling on either side. of Yak too.
Donkey kong, on like.
Screw fixin typos
So it begins...... Battery spot welder - Scott7022 - 10-24-2023
Lol. Thanks for the screw fixing typos. I had Tried to look up the new word I didn’t know. You’ve increased my vocabulary before, so…figured it was Cali surf slang when I didn’t find it on dictionary. Lol.
Now I can rest easy.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
RE: So it begins...... Battery spot welder - sternwake - 10-24-2023
I done maKes up new nomenclature alls the time.
Seems speaking in full, concise sentences , round these parts, can seriously confuse and irritate the 'listener'
another reason to not engage., and love dogs instead.
Ill also point out the crow I should eat as I'm too daMn honeat, and missed the class on self ego stroking.
My Ridgid 18v battery charger /power supply, has an OCV of 21.42v, and the 18v nominal 5S battery pack at full charge is 2!.00v.
It usually is in the 21.2v range when amps taper to 0.1 and it shuts off, but sometimes behaves a bit differently. Ive seen anywhere from 20.3 to 20.8v immediately after it shuts off.
Makita and Dewalt too.
The skate battery is reading 29.32v 24 hours later.
I did pull it off charger manually, but no idea if it woukld have terminated a few seconds later ,automatically.
I can however, easily place my one 5 amp XL4015 CCCV buckers inline, and diaL in 29.40,v and dial the max charge amperage as well, and prevent overcharge.
If i Use my Dc to Dc booster, can charge @150 watts, instead of 42.
Slower charging has the potential of keeping the center located cells closer to the ones on the end..
My 3s 12.6v battery, that middle cell is always the lowest, no matter which of the 3 matched cells, is placed in middle.
The e skate is likely designed to reach 100% asap, rather than baby the battery for best long term longelvity. But can the likely low quality cells handle it, safely?
If charge time is important, the why the 1.5 amp / 40ish watt charger limit?
But having it come off the charger at well over 4.2v per cell, is not somethjng ive witnessed on any other lithium battery, and i monitor them all, pretty much every time.
Im not going to trust the provided charger, without monitoring it.
Somehow, i have managed to not ride the Eskate today.
It is so ridiculouslyr fun.
I could not imagine being 13 again, and having such an item available.
I was leery of the short board and wheelbase, and luckily, my butt on pavement events were not seriously consequential.
I suspect if i hadnt been the rotator cuff muscle Nazi for a whike now it coukd have been a far different result.
Also, ive been riding skateboards for 40+ years nkw, and learned how to fall when falling was not really
consequential tk a rubber boned youthful arthritis free body.
The Sapele Fore Kayak Fiona perch is curjng under 2 layers of epoxy.
Meant to add the third within the epoxy chemical bond window, but.....
It is such an amazingly pretty wood. Like a striped blonde mahogany.
such a shame to cover it in a traction pad.